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Talk:Central America under Mexican rule

Good articleCentral America under Mexican rule has been listed as one of the Warfare good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Did You Know Article milestones
DateProcessResult
November 22, 2022Good article nomineeListed
March 5, 2023Guild of Copy EditorsCopyedited
October 26, 2023WikiProject A-class reviewApproved
May 3, 2024Peer reviewReviewed
Did You Know A fact from this article appeared on Wik.ipedia.Pro's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on December 4, 2022.
The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that the Central American government voted for annexation to the First Mexican Empire after a request from Regent Agustín de Iturbide?
Current status: Good article


GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:Central America under Mexican rule/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: MX (talk · contribs) 18:11, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Part 1 Review

Hello. I'll be reviewing this article and be posting my findings here. First part will be a copyedit/content review. The second part will include source verification. Stay tuned. MX (✉ • ✎) 18:11, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

General comments, Part 1: Great read. The article is comprehensive and includes detailed information about the rule and events. I made several copyedits myself so please revisit them and let me know if you have any questions/comments. There are some instances where WP:REDLINK is applicable; this is a good practice on Wik.ipedia.Pro that encourages others to create articles on subjects that do not exist yet.

@MX: Thanks for the feedback! I hope I addressed all your points below. PizzaKing13 ¡Hablame! 04:09, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Part 2 of the review coming up. MX (✉ • ✎) 22:55, 21 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Independence of New Spain

  • Iturbide invited Ferdinand VII, any member of his immediate family, or any other Spanish Bourbon prince to rule as the Mexican emperor.[12] — Could we consider writing as "Emperor of Mexico" as opposed to "Mexican emperor"? I saw that this was consistent of Agustin's article and the title of the article hyperlinked too.
    • Done Green tickY
  • launched attempted rebellions in 1811 and 1814 (es) to gain independence — Could we redlink 1814 per WP:REDLINK?
    • Done Green tickY
  • The Spanish provincial governors of Central America at the time of independence were: Juan Manuel de Cañas y Trujillo (es) (Costa Rica),[24] Pedro Barriere (El Salvador),[25] Gabino Gaínza y Fernández de Medrano (Guatemala),[19] José Gregorio Tinoco de Contreras (de) (Honduras),[26] Miguel González Saravia y Colarte (es) (Nicaragua).[25] — Same goes here for those with the Spanish-language articles that do not have one in English.
    • Done Green tickY

Central American infighting over annexation

  • and the Aycinena clan (es) of Guatemala. — Please redlink
    • Done Green tickY
  • Meanwhile, Costa Ricans were initially opposed from independence from Spain, and at the time, there was no definitive consensus as to whether Costa Rica favored or opposed annexation — Need further clarification here. Consider writing as "Meanwhile, Costa Ricans were initially opposed to independence from Spain; at that time, there was no definitive consensus as to whether Costa favored or opposed annexation.
    • Changed Green tickY
  • Each singular vote represents the decision of an entire municipality's population, not the vote of single individuals. — Is this claim supported by the sources in the infobox (#43 and 44)? Just want to make sure. All other footnotes have references so I would advise you add one too for this claim to follow the format.
    • Yes, it is. Added. Green tickY

Annexation and subsequent separatist conflicts

  • Chilean Sergeant Nicolás de Abós y Padilla (es). — Please redlink
    • Done. Green tickY
  • Manuel Arzú (es) on 19 March 1822, — Please redlink
    • Done. Green tickY
  • Juan Francisco Sosa from El Salvador, and Colonel Felipe Codallos and Lieutenant Colonel José Luis González Ojeda from Guatemala — I know we don't have their articles in Spanish, but based on your research, do you think Sosa and Glz Ojeda could eventually have their own articles? If so, please redlink.
    • Sosa held the position of Secretary Deputy in the Central American assembly, but I can't find any other mention of him anywhere in my research so I think it's unlikely. Meanwhile González Ojeda is mentioned only one time in both sources and it's for this occasion, so I think this one is even less likely.
  • formulation of the new Mexican constitution — Hyperlink with Constitution of Mexico if applicable
    • That page is for the 1917 constitution only. This constitution for 1822/23 was never drafted, and I don't think there is enough information on it to warrant having a page on Wik.ipedia.Pro.
  • The Electoral Junta was succeeded by the Superior Gubernatorial Junta (es) on 13 January 1822, and its president, Rafael Barroeta y Castilla (es), began preparations to hold elections which would determine Costa Rica's representatives in the Mexican Constituent Congress (es). The election was held on 31 January 1822 — Please redlink all mentions were applicable
    • Done Green tickY
  • in the Battle of Ochomogo. — Question here. The link sends to "Ochomogo War", not Battle of Ochomogo. Was there a Battle with the same name as the civil war?
    • As far as I am aware, the Ochomogo War is the Battle of Ochomogo. My sources all prefer "Battle of Ochomogo" so I list it as that.
  • led by Manuel Alvarado e Hidalgo (es) on 10 May 1823, which remained in power until September 1824 — Same here, redlink
    • Done Green tickY
  • On 23 February 1823, Miguel González Saravia y Colarte (es), — Same here
    • Done Green tickY
  • González Saravia stepped down as the governor of Nicaragua and was replaced by José Carmen Salazar — Question here. Do you think it would make sense to redlink "Governor of Nicaragua"? This position no longer exists of course, but I'm wondering if it is something we could expand with further research. Same question applies to Salazar if you think enough material exists. Consider redlinking if applicable to both.
    • The article for President of Nicaragua already has content for the Governor of Nicaragua, only that it doesn't cover the period for 1821–1825 since I guess no one has gotten around to it. I linked it there. I also linked José Carmen Salazar. Green tickY
  • resulting in Ordóñez overthrowing the government of Pablo Méndez in August 1824 — Same here, consider redlinking Pablo Méndez.
    • Done. Green tickY

Independence from Mexico

  • Would you say we have to capitalize the words Congress and President for all mentions here?
    • I can't remember where I saw or who told me, but the mention of "president" should be lowercase since it's not attached to a name (ie: President José Matías Delgado, compared to José Matías Delgado, the president). Similarly, congress isn't the official name of the Central American congress, which it didn't really have an official name. The sources just say "Central American congress" or "congress" or "congress of Central America" so I left it lowercase. PizzaKing13 ¡Hablame! 04:07, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Government

All good here.

Economy

All good here.

Part 2 Review

Pinging PizzaKing13 for visibility on my last part of the review. Nice job! MX (✉ • ✎) 05:10, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

  • The incorporation of Central America brought Mexico to the height of its territorial extent.[1] — Is there a chance to include this fact in the body paragraphs, that way we can remove the source for this specific claim from the lead per MOS:CITELEAD? This is a suggestion but would elevate the article as it is common practice at GA and FA.
    • Moved to the second to last paragraph of the "Central American infighting over annexation" section.
  • Not all of Central America chose to become independent, however, as the region of Chiapas remained a part of Mexico and is now one of the country's 31 states. In recent times, the far-right Nationalist Front of Mexico (FNM) has called for the reincorporation of Central America to Mexico.[5] — Same here, if possible. In addition, "in recent times" should be avoided per MOS:CURRENT. Please rephrase to the appropriate time terms.
    • I can't really move it out to anywhere which makes sense. I've searched hard to find anywhere where someone has called for Central America's annexation after 1823, but I found nothing, only the FNM. I changed the sentence to "In its "25-Point Program", the far-right Nationalist Front of Mexico (FNM) has called for the reincorporation of Central America to Mexico."

Sources, closing comments

  • I checked all the references and made sure they take readers to the appropriate sources. All checks out.
  • I checked a few sources for appropriate attribution and all checks out.
  • All of the sources are reliable; some require print/offline access. Nothing controversial was found that made me request a direct quote.
  • Article is well written; should nominator want to promote it to FA status, I recommend a copyedit request at GOCE.

@MX: Thanks for reviewing this article! I've responded to your last 2 comments. PizzaKing13 ¡Hablame! 05:39, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

GA assessment

Good Article review progress box
Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV ()
3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant ()
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Comments/questions have been addressed. Article passes! MX (✉ • ✎) 06:15, 22 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wik.ipedia.Pro talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron (talk) 07:51, 26 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(
)
Agustín de Iturbide, Regent of the First Mexican Empire.
Agustín de Iturbide, Regent of the First Mexican Empire.

Improved to Good Article status by PizzaKing13 (talk). Self-nominated at 20:17, 22 November 2022 (UTC).[reply]

General: Article is new enough and long enough
Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: @PizzaKing13: Good article. Will have to AGF on the offline and foreign language sources. Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:56, 25 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Copy editing notes 1

Hey there! I'm working on this copy edit for the . Since it's a longer article, I have some notes. Some of the issues that arose require a bit more work than a basic copy edit, so I've summarized them here. I can come back to this article, but I'm also pinging @PizzaKing13 who did a great job of getting this to GA status.

Things to do:

  1. This links to a disambiguation page, which isn't ideal. I think we should either try to create a list article for these specific wars, or just list them by name.
    1. On 1 July 1823, the Central American congress declared independence from Mexico and established the United Provinces of Central America, later known as the Federal Republic of Central America, which existed until its dissolution in 1841 after a series of civil wars.
I've mentioned both by name.
  1. Define New Spain at its first mention.
Defined
  1. General point of clarification: it's unclear what exactly we are talking about when we say Central America. Are we talking about Central America (geographic region including Belize and Panama) or Central America (set of provinces in the First Mexican Empire)? I think it differs in different sentences. This might take some work to parse out.
    1. See also: Central America#Different definitions
It only refers to the provinces of the First Mexican Empire. It should all be referring to Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua, and Costa Rica + Belize which was a part of Guatemala and Chiapas which split from Guatemala.
  1. Need secondary source, as this is a primary source and does not make evident the notability of this incident.
    1. In 2017, the far-right Nationalist Front of Mexico called for the reincorporation of Central America to Mexico in its "25-Point Program".[1][better source needed]
Finding another source on that is basically impossible, I exhausted all my research trying to find that one source.
  1. Ideally the Captaincy government section's table has refs (although they're obviously in the paragraph above, so this isn't critical).

Also, I've replaced instances of "Agustín I" and "Iturbide" with "Agustín", consistent with Agustín de Iturbide.

I'll probably have a little bit more as I continue working through the article! Wracking 💬 07:50, 2 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Wracking: Thanks for taking the time to copyedit this! PizzaKing13 ¡Hablame! 16:27, 2 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Copy editing notes 2

Pinging you again @PizzaKing13! Most of these notes are about things I would have changed myself, but wanted to double-check.

  • As for my concerns about the meaning of Central America, I think it's clear as long as we don't link to Central America in anywhere else except the lead. I got confused when it was linked in other sections.
  • There's a sentence I already reworded, and I call attention to it just in case. I double checked with the source, but I wanted to make sure I haven't misrepresented the intended meaning.
was changed to
On 1 April 1823, in Alajuela, republican Gregorio José Ramírez was declared leader of the opposition.
(we could possibly tack on "to Oreamuno" to the end, if needed, but I think it's pretty clear based on the preceding and succeeding sentences.)
  • Ramírez was basically declared as a rival claimant political chief of Costa Rica. That second sentence (to me) implies he was declared the leader of an opposition faction within a government (which wasn't the case), since they effectively established an entire other government.
  • From a cursory check of the source, I couldn't clarify this one myself. Could we add either "their decision" (the Mexican congress') or "the Central American congress' decision" to this sentence for clarification?
  • The Mexican congress did instruct him, however, to respect the congress' decision whether to remain in union with Mexico or to become an independent state.[2]
  • Added "Central American".
  • Another one I wasn't able to clarify myself: Did Filísola actually resign and withdraw in response to this boycott, or was that just an (unmet) condition of Chiapas, Costa Rica, Honduras, and Nicaragua?
  • Chiapas, Costa Rica, Honduras, and Nicaragua boycotted the conference until Filísola resigned as captain general and withdrew all Mexican forces from Central America.[3][4][5]
  • None of the sources mentioned that he resigned, so yes it was an unmet condition. I amended the sentence to make this less ambigious.
  • Could we remove the passive voice from this sentence for clarity? I'm pretty sure it's Mexico doing this, but I wasn't 100% sure, so left it as-is.
  • In an attempt to alleviate the debt and economic troubles, a tariff law was passed in 1822—placing taxes on various exports from Central America—and the exporting of coins was made illegal.[6]
possibly to
In an attempt to alleviate its debt and economic troubles, Mexico passed a tariff law in 1822, placing taxes on various exports from Central America, and made the exporting of coins illegal.[6]
  • This law was passed by the captaincy general government, so I substituted the current sentence with your suggestion and changed Mexico to captaincy general.

I don't think I'll have many more notes! I'll do a final read-through tomorrow and then check it off my list. Wracking 💬 08:07, 4 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Wracking: Responded, thanks for the comments! PizzaKing13 ¡Hablame! 08:31, 4 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Copy editing notes 3

Last time @PizzaKing13 :] Alright, I did my final read-through! Thanks for all your work on responding to my suggestions! Just one note for this one, otherwise I think it's in pretty good shape.

  • I did further editing on the boycott sentence that I wanted to note, in case it misses the mark.
  • Chiapas, Costa Rica, Honduras, and Nicaragua stated that they would boycott the conference until Filísola resigns as captain general and withdraws all Mexican forces from Central America.[3][4][5]
to this
Chiapas, Costa Rica, Honduras, and Nicaragua stated that they would boycott the conference in an attempt to make Filísola resign as captain general and withdraw all Mexican forces from Central America.[3][4][5]

Wracking 💬 05:48, 5 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Wracking: The first sentence is more correct, since none of the sources mention that they were attempting to make Filísola resign. "Some nationalist localities refused to send representatives until Filísola had retired with his Mexican troops" (Stanger 1932, p. 40). "The Congress opened on June 29, 1823, with representatives of Honduras, Nicaragua, Chiapas, and Costa Rica absent" (Kenyon 1961, p. 240), a footnote explains the Mexican military presence is why they boycotted the congress. Anyway, thanks for the CE!PizzaKing13 ¡Hablame! 07:44, 5 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@PizzaKing13: Got it—that's why I wanted to check! And no problem. Wracking 💬 08:06, 5 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  1. ^ Nationalist Front of Mexico 2017.
  2. ^ Kenyon 1961, p. 199.
  3. ^ a b c Stanger 1932, p. 40.
  4. ^ a b c Kenyon 1961, p. 200.
  5. ^ a b c Meléndez Chaverri 2000, p. 274.
  6. ^ a b Smith 1963, p. 490.
Retrieved from "https://en.Wik.ipedia.Pro.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Central_America_under_Mexican_rule&oldid=1225047660"

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